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Buy the right compiler and programmer

 
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GiG



Joined: 03 Sep 2021
Posts: 39

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Buy the right compiler and programmer
PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 12:29 am     Reply with quote

Hi, I wanted tips to buy a good programmer and hardware compiler that also has debugger capability with CCS.
Thank you.
temtronic



Joined: 01 Jul 2010
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Location: Greensville,Ontario

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 6:25 am     Reply with quote

First, you'll have to decide which 'family' of PICs you'll be using..16,18,24,32 ?
If for 'home or hobby' use, I'd think the 16 series,which requires a less expensive compiler than the PIC18 series, though years ago I decided on using JUST the PIC18F46K22 for 99.44% of all projects and products. At the time it had the most memories, peripherals and can run at 3 or 5 volts. Since then 100s of new PICs have come out, so maybe there's a 16 series that has those features you require, and future ones ?
While using a 40 pin PIC for most projects sounds 'silly', I've always had more than enough memory and pins for the projects, though 3 years ago, I used all but 1 I/O pin ! While it costs more than a smaller,cheaper device, over the years I've created an entire library of solid, known good, reliable code. New PICs and compiler versions may have 'quirks' or 'bugs' that may not appear for days or months. While newer PICs have some great features...do YOU really need them ? Often you can use and 'older' PIC to do the same task but..only YOU know what needs to be done.
Bottom line.... choose the HARDWARE first, then the compiler
GiG



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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 6:56 am     Reply with quote

Thanks for guidance, I use the 16 series.
16F19

But I may go to 18 later, so if it supports both 16 and 18, it would be better for me.
Do you have any suggestions about the type of programmer? My focus is on the debugger with CCS.
Ttelmah



Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 7:34 am     Reply with quote

On the programmer, it depends massively on what you actually want to do.
So (for example), the Mach-X, can also function as a debugger, and has
the big advantage over the ICD units of programming chips directly in it's
socket. However if all the boards are going to have ICSP ports then a simple
debugger is cheaper. The ICD-U64, I find much more reliable than the
U80. This latter has improved as the software has been updated, but
still seems to have more issues, and is often not much if any quicker
(speed is limited by the actual time needed to program the flash itself,
rather than by the speed of the programmer). The 'Load-n-go' programmer,
is great if you want to program units that are not on your workbench.
Choice depends what you are going to do.....
GiG



Joined: 03 Sep 2021
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2021 1:01 am     Reply with quote

Ttelmah wrote:
On the programmer, it depends massively on what you actually want to do.
So (for example), the Mach-X, can also function as a debugger, and has
the big advantage over the ICD units of programming chips directly in it's
socket. However if all the boards are going to have ICSP ports then a simple
debugger is cheaper. The ICD-U64, I find much more reliable than the
U80. This latter has improved as the software has been updated, but
still seems to have more issues, and is often not much if any quicker
(speed is limited by the actual time needed to program the flash itself,
rather than by the speed of the programmer). The 'Load-n-go' programmer,
is great if you want to program units that are not on your workbench.
Choice depends what you are going to do.....



All these devices I saw have Rj12 connectors.
I use ICSP on board.
Is it possible to program ICSP and debug with ICSP with these devices? Because their connectors are different.
Since you are a professional, between Mach-X and ICD-U64 which one is better?
All I need is to program one or two PICs with the computer, and the importance of working is on the debugger and the extent of support for different pics!
Another important issue is that it can read programs from the PIC.
Ttelmah



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:09 am     Reply with quote

Which connectors are different?.

The ICSP connector is the same connector used for ICD. A few chips
(some of the very small PIC16's etc.), have to have special debug versions
of the chips, because they have so few pins, that you can't really build a
usable unit without using the ICSP pins. However on 99% of the chips
all you do is use the ICSP pins if you intend to use ICD.
The connectors on both the U64 and the Mach-X are the same and you
just need a short cable to the ICSP port. If all programming is using the
standard ICSP connector, then the U64 gives fewer problems with 3.3v chips.
On the Mach-X, the older models have to have hardware changes for some
of the 3.3v chips (in some cases these can be DIY, while for others it has
to go back to CCS).
dyeatman



Joined: 06 Sep 2003
Posts: 1910
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2021 2:58 pm     Reply with quote

I have quite a few development boards without the RJ12 where I use an RJ12 to
ICSP adapter with my ICD-U64 and it works fine.

Here is a $5 one that I use:
https://microcontrollershop.com/product_info.php?products_id=5703

and there are a number of other sources.
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bkamen



Joined: 07 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:18 am     Reply with quote

I like the PIC18 and PIC24 series most of the time.

I tend to use an ICD3 and the PICkit3 and PICkit4. They work fine.

And the ICD has that 6pin modular (you should wiki for "registered jack" sometime...) which is easy to adapt to the 6pin ICSP header which is mostly what I put on my board designs.

In either case (i.e. you don't want the bulky 6pin modular connector), debugging is fine with the ICSP setup.
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dyeatman



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:33 am     Reply with quote

I agree. I use the 6 pin SIP rather than the RJ12 jack in all my designs.
I can fit that in most anywhere.
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Ttelmah



Joined: 11 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 04, 2021 2:57 am     Reply with quote

Dead right.
The point is that there are five connections needed for the standard ICD/
ICSP operation. There are at least three 'connectors' commonly used to
carry these. The RJ12, a five or six pin SIL, and the Tag connect system.
They can all simply be adapted between using suitable cables.
The SIL connector is one of the simplest and cheapest. The Tag connect
system is smaller, but a bit fussy. The RJ, 'historically' was the commonest,
but is tending now to fall out of favour, largely because of it's size.
Choose whichever one you prefer, and stick with this. Get a cable for this,
and also for RJ12, in case you use something like one of the CCS boards.
PrinceNai



Joined: 31 Oct 2016
Posts: 452
Location: Montenegro

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2021 5:05 am     Reply with quote

I always use a 6 pin 0,1"" SIL, labeled ICD with a big M for pin 1 on my PCB's. The sixth pin is extra, of course, but it is there to prevent some higher component to be placed there, interfering with the cable. And it is also way easier to read then the phone connector. No ups and downs, straight to the next one from pin 1.
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